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Hi, people,<br><br>
lets us see what the expectation we have from a preparatory meeting? If
its only discussion programm and correct some logistic, getting to know
each other better, but not dealing with visas, then maybe its also enough
make it a bit later in Apil if March is difficult? We defanately need t
check location of the seminar that it comfortable for all etc.<br>
lets see first who want or able to come first, and then see which dae the
best for all?<br>
Fabian, Jane, Karl-Heinz, Andrea, Zaczek, Laura, Ute (Vlad?),
Michael???<br>
There is some money to cover the cost of travel and accomodation that we
don't need to deal with costs of the trip very strickly
yourself.<br><br>
For me personally the meeting is important to have as early as possible
to get to know each other, get inspiration for tuture preparation. It is
another feeling when you feel not alone. with a list is anothe vitual
feeling. <br><br>
I will attach our old AD that we get the feeling how it all has
started:-)<br><br>
regards, Olga<br><br>
<u>How the idea was born (digest of ideas from alter-ee mailing list
www.):<br>
</u>
> West would have a problem even understand East.<br>
<br>
“Perhaps we need to deconstruct this "West": certainly there
are many people, as much in the activist and anarchist milieux as
anywhere else, who have no interest in understanding the East, whether
that is a European East or extends beyond Europe. (It took me some time
to realise that when they use the word "we" it stands for
Western Europeans!) Indeed, they do not want to understand people outside
their own circles, they simply want to act as missionaries preaching
whatever message of world salvation that happens to have afflicted their
minds /.:/<br>
Further, I feel that it is necessary to speak of an anti Eastern European
racism. The reason why this goes further than chauvinism is that
historically it has used the Nazi methods of extermination. In Western
Europe there is a marked reluctance to accept that the Nazi's regarded
Slavs as sub-human /… /. Further all this took place in a context where
anti-Slav racism had<br>
been prevalent amongst radical circles (e.g. Engels), and indeed the cold
war retained an anti-Slav element hiding behind the anti-communism.“ -
Fabian.<br>
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“I don't know anymore what is right and what is wrong and I stop
considered myself neither Eastern neither become Western (never actually
wanted). I prefer to stay so as I am without labels. In the same time I
cannot shut up my thoughts about the two different worlds I stay
in-between how put it together. Now I know these two worlds more less the
same to be able have opinion out of "cultural codes". The only
judder I can hear is my heart. This I prefer to keep: stay myself without
try fit to others.<br>
What makes me angry how East goes not want understand the West and
how less the negative aspects of the Western society is covered and
discussed in post-soviet countries. In the same time the East presented
in Western media as alcoholics-vodka-swimming society, full of stupid
things etc. I see there missing to be a balance in understanding or wish
to learn more about each other out of the labels or cultural stereotypes.
In 1999 there was interesting project started to cover the informational
gap in between East and West on activism issue to avoid NGOs tourisms,
Tusovka newsletter
<a href="http://www.savanne.ch/tusovka/welcome.en.html">
http://www.savanne.ch/tusovka/welcome.en.html</a>. It was an attempt
bring topic from the surface on the personal level.<br>
I only want to say that the topic East-West is not easy one; it’s
required a lot of honesty, tolerance and patience. For those with “mask”
approach I would not recommend join this list cause of danger of
shking an inner world and adopted from close environment peceptions J If
somebody really and honestly interesting to dive in it, not afraid become
emotional and trough unpleasant discovering get release and freedom, I
recommend to join the list. I would be very glad share of ideas, to
listen to others and slowly find the way to the bridge which might
connect us, might also not but it worth to try.“ - Olga <br>
<br>
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<br>
“O, I would like elaboration on the concept of western people not being
able to understand the >soul of the east> idea, I am paraphrasing
here, this is something often touched upon but I would like more
discussion of the idea, partially because this is a chance to critique
the idea of >who holds knowledge, and who is meant to listen> and
also because from the other side it is an often made comment against
western activists of how they >just don’t get it> but without
supporting statements of just what they are not getting?”, - Jane<br>
<br>
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<br>
<br>
<br>
“For me, some of these E-W topics are reminiscent of the kinds of broad
cultural/anthropological once /.../ What is interesting to me is also
which topics are not developed in the West that are in the East and vice
versa and so on. Of course you cannot even say "East" really
because you can see some big differences between, for example Poland and
Russia, so it's more of a "culture by culture" topic. /…/ I
sometimes feel like the information gap is one of the problems. <br>
I don't know how many people from Western Europe have had this
experience. You travel somewhere, meet a fellow activist and start to
talk about something you're doing and all of a sudden you feel like
you're from another planet /…/Some people in the West (and even some in
the East) feel that this topic is taboo. After all, we're all human
beings, we all have a similar set of<br>
values, and we should be coming from the same perspective. Some people
feel this question as I have put it concentrates on division and not what
we have in common. Maybe - I think it's a topic that has lingered in the
background for the last 10 years but few people want to really talk about
/…/<br>
My hope would be that anybody who is interested in increasing the
exchange between east and west really try to have a discussion on their
experiences.“ Laure<br>
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
”I think perhaps a list for some East-West comparison would be useful if
it could deal with a whole range of issues”, - Fabian<br>
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“If only I’ll find a chance I’ll definitely write longer concerning these
topics of<br>
"Cultural (burning) bridges /…/ In Berlin, but also Amsterdam,
Barcelona, etc. (I was<br>
many times there) ALWAYS I encountered deep disinterest of local
"majority scene"(German, Dutch...) towards EE realities. It was
like all my political activities<br>
back in Poland didn't mean a fuck, nobody (including friends) was willing
to hear much about it or make solid contacts /…/On other hand through all
these years, despite of large EE community in Berlin, I was most of the
times one of very few foreigners deeply involved in<br>
political activities (affinity groups, actions, preparations and
organizing<br>
demonstrations, publishing propaganda, etc.)/…/Yet, strongly
anti-political attitude of "easterners“ I cannot excuse, gaps are
fucking big in general. strange to think, but<br>
after spending over 7 years in Berlin I realised that all my better
friends are of non-German<br>
origin (EE, Italy, Iran, Turkey/Kurdistan, etc.). It shouldn't matter in
perfect world, but in this one it indicates a lot. EE have
characteristics of "negative exotic" -in the west there are
attractions towards Latin America or Spain e.g., because these places are
Christian populated, sunny and easily romanticised /…/Sorry, I’d love to
extend topic, but my access is shit, in some time I put longer text on
that,” – Muri<br>
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<br>
“I am convinced we need such an East-West exchange bullshit, we need to
put the steam way (both sides). It's more less like in partnership: you
need go through certain fights till you get some harmony and
understanding afterwards. I would not mind to be open enough with it. The
shyness, tabooisation or hesitation due to the Westerners
"politeness" or Eastern silence cause of not knowing dominant
English language properly or other factors) create certain tension and
produce unnecessary hypocrisy of coexistence with hidden inception of
each other. To be accepted is necessary to know each other and be aware
what other thinks of you to see yourself in other way, to have a mirror.
For this there are needs of explanations, analysis why this like this or
like that. The big role here plays personal experience, which change a
person itself and can help others. I am constantly in migrant’s circles
and learn to learn also from others to understand certain things about
our differences and connections. Therefore I need more stories to read
and think about. And sometimes I need a stage to put steam out, something
like mailing list”, - Olga<br>
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